Falchi escribió:Para mí... decepcionante lo que cuenta este vídeo.
Está en inglés pero es muy corto, habla claro y tiene subtítulos (en inglés). Se entiende perfectamente lo que está pasando.
Los coches, en un atasco, pueden ser, y son, teletransportados...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DH41JiEwZV4
Stanjov escribió:Falchi escribió:Para mí... decepcionante lo que cuenta este vídeo.
Está en inglés pero es muy corto, habla claro y tiene subtítulos (en inglés). Se entiende perfectamente lo que está pasando.
Los coches, en un atasco, pueden ser, y son, teletransportados...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DH41JiEwZV4
Un desarrollador ha comentado que es así, pero en situaciones "muy específicas" en las que se buguee un coche. La idea es que el atasco afecte a la jugabilidad, pero no hasta el punto en el que el juego se vuelva injugable como ocurría en Sim City
Probablemente sea algo que pueda quitarse con un mod.
![[360º]](/images/smilies/nuevos/vueltas.gif "como la niña del exorcista")
Alright, let's try to get some clear concise information out there.
What's the issue here?
Cities: Skylines has a mechanic that will teleport vehicles to their destination if they can't reach their destination due to extreme traffic problems.
Why was this mechanic put in?
The mechanic prevents traffic jams from getting so out of hand that it destroys your entire city's traffic simulation, which would shut down your whole city.
What counts as extreme?Azurespecter escribió:The situation where citizens actually respawn or vanish is quite rare, and is a system in place to make sure that the simulation doesn't break due to very, very bad traffic problems. You basically have to design an intentionally defective road system, and then ignore the blatantly obvious traffic congestion while you keep forcing more and more people to use that route, all the while making that route the only way for citizens to get to their destination.
The city in the video posted at the beginning of this thread is a disaster. The makers of this city were showing off certain aspects of the game, and mistakenly ignored this traffic problem. I'm not dissing the makers of the city, it was just a simple oversight that is now being overexaggerated and considered a "norm" when it certainly is not normal. The honest truth is that this round-a-bout/highway route is a functional nightmare. Plan your city just a little better, and you'll probably never see disappearing vehicles.
Can you give an example of extreme?
Take a look at this picture. Thanks PC2K for posting these very informative pictures, by the way.
Look at how far back that traffic line goes! That's a LOT of stuck cars. Check out the distance of this traffic jam. That's a congo-line of 200 plus cars that just aren't going anywhere.
Oh, and to add to the problem, there is no other way to get to that city section. No alternatives existed for those "vanishing" vehicles to take.
Can we still have traffic jams?
Of course! This mechanic isn't eliminating traffic problems, or magically curing them, and it's certainly not a cheat. It's an emergency feature.
I did some tests, and I had traffic congestion filling up 5 whole intersections in a city. Not a single vanishing car. I tested again on a highway, 67 cars backed up... no disappearing.
Your traffic problems aren't going away because of this feature.
Doesn't this feature break the simulation?
That's one way to look at it. The unfortunate matter is that traffic simulation can't be perfect. There will always be situations that can't be mimicked correctly. In this case, citizens stuck in super long traffic jams can't reroute. They don't have the logic to pull a U-turn and go looking for a new route.
And as you can see in this showcased city, there weren't even alternative routes to take.
So your opinion is valid, we understand that this backup feature isn't realistic. But we consider it necessary because without some kind of backup mechanic, it would literally break your entire city's traffic simulation.
What would happen if the mechanic was turned off?
The city in this video had the traffic problem on a highway. Without the mechanic, that traffic would have piled back into the city, effectively blocking every single intersection. No services or citizens would be getting anywhere, even if it was just a block away.
If this traffic nightmare happened inner-city, your city would flood so fast that your city would break and you'd go bankrupt, all your citizens would move away, and your buildings would all be abandoned before you could properly fix the problem. Even after you fixed the problem, your city would take a long time to re-adjust and fix itself.
This is what we mean by "broken simulation". We believe that this situation would be unenjoyable for most of our players (if they even ever encounter this problem).
Remember, this is only in situations where the traffic is so dire that your citizens can't even take alternative routes.
What if I want traffic to flood into my city and shut everything down? REALISM!
Just being straightforward: gameplay comes first in this situation. As stated above, we believe most of our players would not enjoy this situation.
Is the real problem here bad logic design by CO?
No. The traffic logic isn't perfect, but that's not the main problem behind this particular traffic jam in this city.
Are round-a-bouts functioning properly?
Yes, but this thread has actually brought up some optimization problems with round-a-bouts, intersections, and lane usage. I did lots of testing and found inconsistencies that I've sent over to CO in a detailed report. I trust that they will do their best to optimize traffic flow.
Thanks for your feedback, and helping us identify ways to improve!
T-Junctions?
Yes, there are T-Junctions. That's what is supposed to happen when you make a round-a-bout. As I mentioned above, there are some inconsistencies with these intersections. You are also correct that upon examination, the round-a-bout traffic flow is not optimized.
However, like I said about citizen pathfinding logic, round-a-bouts are not the main problem behind this particular traffic jam.
In conclusion: this video happens to find a gross overexaggeration of this emergency backup feature in action. It's very unlikely you'll ever see it, unless you actually attempt to make it happen as I had to do in my testing.
Reservado en Nuveem como muchos de vosotros 
Falchi escribió:
Mulzani escribió:Por cierto, ¿se sabe si existe paso del tiempo? Es decir, que puedas elegir empezar por una ciudad en 1900, por ejemplo, y conforme se avance tenga estilos edificatorios y nuevas infraestructuras que no tienes de inicio y no porque tu ciudad tenga pocos habitantes.
Mulzani escribió:Sólo hay que mirar SimCity 4 para darse cuenta que el permitir varios estilos le daba un toque único a la ciudad, por eso lo que había preguntado antes, si habría transcurso del tiempo, pudiendo comenzar en épocas diferentes, porque le daría un aspecto único a cada ciudad, poder tener zonas de la escuela de Chicago, luego de Art Déco, o de modernismo... Según donde o cuando se haya desarrollado más la ciudad.
Devil_Riddick escribió:A las 6 o a las 5? Porque el horario oficial es a las 18:00 h CET, y en España tenemos CET + 1 xD
anibaltw escribió:Igual ponen los dlcs siendo la base y los mods sirven para cambiar las skins de esos dlcs, o eso entiendo con la foto
[–]TotalyMooCOMMUNITY MANAGER AT PARADOX INTERACTIVE[S] 14 puntos an hour ago
Expect most expansions/DLC's to be larger more "old school" type updates where we bundle many new features and content in one go. There might be smaller things here and there but our main focus lies with substantial expansions that make you feel like they add a lot of value to an already great game
Gamerlol escribió:Me gusta ver que va a haber DLC tipo expansión de antaño, que realmente son los que merecen la pena
Leyenda18 escribió:Gamerlol escribió:Me gusta ver que va a haber DLC tipo expansión de antaño, que realmente son los que merecen la pena
La política de DLC de paradox desde CKII tiene mucho que ver con esa filosofía old-school de sacar expansiones. Aparte están todos los DLCs de canciones y skins que no influyen en nada en las mecánicas del juego y que no hay ninguna necesidad de adquirir.
![[oki]](/images/smilies/net_thumbsup.gif "Ok!")
Hohen escribió:Nuevo mensaje por parte de CO/Paradox, donde nos quieren aclarar el tema de modificar el límite de 9 cuadrados (tiles) desbloqueables. Al parecer, el Responsable de Comunidad de Paradox, TotalyMoo, viene a decir que han cometido un error en su labor de comunicar la "facilidad" con la que esa modificación se puede llevar a cabo. Deja claro que tener 25 cuadrados de 2km x 2km es posible, pero también augura que no será fácil, y que su equipo no va a dar soporte alguno en esta cuestión.
Dice que la gente: youtubers, streamers, prensa, etc. ha supuesto que sería algo fácil de modificar, pero ellos nunca quisieron decir que sería fácil, sino que simplemente es posible.
Después cita a Mariina, la CEO de Colossal Order, donde pide perdón y vuelve a repetir que la modificación es posible, pero "muy, muy difícil", "aunque ella no es programador".
Finalmente cita a Damien, programador de CO, y es aquí donde detalla las razones por las que desbloquear más cuadrados no es "simplemente incrementar el número de ellos disponibles", sino que "hay una necesidad de tratar el problema de la lógica, la indexación, las limitaciones del área, calcular los recursos disponibles, y seguramente otras muchas cosas" [...] "algunas de esas funciones son parte de los cimientos del núcleo del juego, y dependen de estructuras de datos muy específicas, algunas de las cuales no son muy intuitivas o lógicas en favor del rendimiento" [...] "Así que y aunque en teoría es posible, en la práctica (la modificación) requerirá algo de ingeniería inversa, una paciencia infinita y bastante maña de modder."
Fuente (en inglés): http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/sho ... st18934067
Y nueva captura:
![[+risas]](/images/smilies/nuevos/risa_ani3.gif "más risas")
